-
Hey All! Lately there has been more and more scammers on the forum board. They register and replies to members requests for guns and/or parts or other things. The reply contains a gmail or hotmail address or similar ”anonymous” email addresses which they want you to reply to. DO NOT ANSWER ANY STRANGE MESSAGES! They often state something like this: ”Hello! Saw your post about purchasing a stock for a Safari. KnuckleheadBob has one. Email him at: [email protected]” If you receive any strange messages: Check the status of whoever message you. If they have no posts and signed up the same day or very recently, stay away. Same goes for other members they might refer to. Check them too and if they are long standing members, PM them and ask if the message is legit. Most likely it’s not. Then use the report function in each message or post so I can kick them out! Beware of anything that might seem fishy! And again, for all of you who registered your personal name as username, please contact me so I can change it to a more anonymous username. You’d be surprised of how much one can find out about a person from just a username on a forum such ad our! All the best! And be safe! Jim
Loads for Rihiimaki Vixen Sporter .223
- Thread starter magothy1
- Start date
Sako Collectors Club Discussion Forum
kirkbridgershooters
Well-Known Member
You might check to make sure it isn't a 222 Remington, I am not aware of Sako making a 223 in a L46. Make sure it's not a L469 either as that would be 222 magnum. A 223 won't fit in a 222 remington magazine either. You should probably check all those things to make sure just what it is that you have...
Nah. Sako .223's shoot conventional bullets of up to (at least) 64 grains just fine. Some sources list their twist as 1-12", but the one of my two which I've actually measured is closer to 1-13". Regardless, your new rifle is just as likely to shoot 60 grainers as well as it does 40 grainers. My go-to load in the .223 I've owned the longest is with a 55 grain Sierra. I've tried some 60 grain Ballistic Tips (a rather long bullet due to its hollow nose cavity, polymer tip, solid base of jacket material, and slight boattail) which shoot groups similar to any lighter bullets I've used.
You may very well find that some lighter bullet shoots the most accurately in your rifle, but it will be other factors than twist which are of greater influence on the accuracy. Simply use whatever bullet best suits the game or target you're after and exhibits good accuracy.
paulsonconstruction
Sako-addicted
No one can predict how any particular bullet will shoot based solely on the twist rate. As long as the twist & velocity are adequate to stabilize the bullet, other factors have more influence on accuracy. Stonecreek has offered sound advice. You shouldn't have too much difficulty finding several accurate bullet/powder combinations. My AI Varmint shoots everything from 40 to 60 grainers very well.
kirkbridgershooters
Well-Known Member
Exactly, I have a Bofors deluxe in 222 magnum and it won't shoot anything over a 40 grain bullet worth a damn. It has been my experience that fast twist does make a difference and anyone that thinks you can't over stabilize a bullet with fast twist is mistaken. I have not seen in any of my rifles a true cross-over that would allow a fast twist to work with light (40-50 grain) bullets.
I bought a new model 85 Varmint with 1/8 twist and I can shoot a 55 grain V-Max extremely well in it, but forget the 40 and 50 grain bullets. I have a Wilson combat AR-15, an extremely well made rifle with 1/7 and you are wasting your time with anything under 55 grains hitting a barn.
I will admit, I have only listed any information from my own shooting and not reading about it on the Internet. I believe that the Internet has done more for mis-information than the Democratic party. I know I am just another voice in the wilderness, but what I am relationg is from personal experience and testing dozens of Sakos over dozens of years and 10's of thousands of rounds shot at varmints and plenty others in magazine articles as we have done some extensive shooting there too.
If I was a betting man, I would say that the 223 will shoot 40 grain V-Max bullets extremely well with H335 powder, regardless of what others may say about the temperature instability of H335 powder is. I have shot tons of H335 and never had the problem that many say you will get with it. This is a picture of just the H335 powder and 22 caliber V-Max bullets I keep handy to shoot in my Sako rifles...
"Temperature stability" and "twist" -- two currently popular hobgoblins among shooting writers who have little else to write about and marketers whose commercial successes depend on casting a pall of obsolescence on anything made "last year".
H335 is simply the commercial canister grade of WC844 -- and WC844 is the powder formulated specifically for the 5.56 Nato, otherwise known as the .223 Remington. I suspect that since the military expects its ammunition to perform appropriately in every imaginable condition that "temperature stability" ain't much of an issue with WC844/H335.
Bottom Gun
Well-Known Member
Gee, I wrote this before I realized this was such an old thread. I’m sure you have it figured out by now but I guess I may as well post this anyway in hopes that someone may find it to be useful.
Your serial number shows your rifle was manufactured in the 1970s. My three Vixens date 1968, 1970 and 1977. All are .223 and have a 12” twist. All three rifles shoot well with bullet weights from 50 to 70 gr.
I’ve been loading .223 ammo for 45 years. In the early days, bullet weights were mostly 55 gr or less. We used IMR4198 powder with 50 to 55 gr. My varmint load was a 52 gr Sierra BTHP (#1410) with a charge of IMR4198.
Lately, I’ve been shooting 60 to 65 gr bullets as well so I’ve started using Win 748 and H335 powder for better velocity. I like these powders because they meter within +/- 0.1 gr in my powder measure so I don’t have to trickle charges like I used to do with the IMR stick powders.
We recently did some bullet testing in our search for controlled expansion hunting loads. We had excellent accuracy and performance from the 60 gr Nosler Partitions, 64 gr Gold Dot, 62 gr Gold Dot, 55 gr Gold Dot (note that gold dots and fusions are the same bullets) and 64 gr Win Power Point.
We found all the above bullets performed like big game bullets in water jugs. They penetrated and expanded well and did not fragment. The Gold Dot/Fusion bullets in particular were ALL quite impressive.
We also tested Sierra 65 gr Game King and Nolser 62 gr Solid Base bullets. The Sierra bullet was very accurate but lacked penetration and fragmented. The Nosler bullet was too inconsistent.
For varmints, I’ve been using the above mentioned Sierra 52 gr BTHP and Speer TNT 50 gr HP.
So those were my findings. I hope some of what I discovered is helpful to you. I think you will find that your new rifle will be superbly accurate with the proper load as most Sakos are.
Your serial number shows your rifle was manufactured in the 1970s. My three Vixens date 1968, 1970 and 1977. All are .223 and have a 12” twist. All three rifles shoot well with bullet weights from 50 to 70 gr.
I’ve been loading .223 ammo for 45 years. In the early days, bullet weights were mostly 55 gr or less. We used IMR4198 powder with 50 to 55 gr. My varmint load was a 52 gr Sierra BTHP (#1410) with a charge of IMR4198.
Lately, I’ve been shooting 60 to 65 gr bullets as well so I’ve started using Win 748 and H335 powder for better velocity. I like these powders because they meter within +/- 0.1 gr in my powder measure so I don’t have to trickle charges like I used to do with the IMR stick powders.
We recently did some bullet testing in our search for controlled expansion hunting loads. We had excellent accuracy and performance from the 60 gr Nosler Partitions, 64 gr Gold Dot, 62 gr Gold Dot, 55 gr Gold Dot (note that gold dots and fusions are the same bullets) and 64 gr Win Power Point.
We found all the above bullets performed like big game bullets in water jugs. They penetrated and expanded well and did not fragment. The Gold Dot/Fusion bullets in particular were ALL quite impressive.
We also tested Sierra 65 gr Game King and Nolser 62 gr Solid Base bullets. The Sierra bullet was very accurate but lacked penetration and fragmented. The Nosler bullet was too inconsistent.
For varmints, I’ve been using the above mentioned Sierra 52 gr BTHP and Speer TNT 50 gr HP.
So those were my findings. I hope some of what I discovered is helpful to you. I think you will find that your new rifle will be superbly accurate with the proper load as most Sakos are.
Thanks for t he help, I should have come back to check in sooner. The rifle likes 40 gr Nosler Varmmagedon HP over H322. It also really likes two 55 gr Noslers, a Varmint with an orange tip and a BT with a black tip. Those two like IMR 4895. The rifle is a ball to shoot. That Sierra #1410 is also a good one. I haven't tried IMR 4198, I'll have to give it a go. Powder supplies being what they are, I don't experiment as much as I used to.
The kinda funny surprise was when I was fire forming new Lapua brass. I loaded just a little lighter than I had been, no crimp, using the orange tip Nosler 55's. It was a very consistent load, as good as anything I worked up.
The kinda funny surprise was when I was fire forming new Lapua brass. I loaded just a little lighter than I had been, no crimp, using the orange tip Nosler 55's. It was a very consistent load, as good as anything I worked up.
This is what has given good results from my L461 Vixen. If used, start with less powder and work up slowly. Poor BC but very accurate and fairly fast. For what it's worth.
Caliber: .223 REM
Bullet: Sierra 1400 - 53 grain HP Match
Primer: CCI 450
Powder: WIN 748 - 28.4 Grains.
Muzzle Velocity : 3350 FPS
Muzzle Energy: 1350 Ballistic Co-efficient: .229
Zero; 200 Yards
Trajectory: Muzzle: -1.5 / 100 Yards; 1.35 / 200 Yards: 0.0 / 300 Yards: -7.05 / 400 Yards: -22.1 /
/ 500 Yards: -48.6 / 600 Yards: -92.4
Works for me. Try it, you might like it. Sakojim.
Caliber: .223 REM
Bullet: Sierra 1400 - 53 grain HP Match
Primer: CCI 450
Powder: WIN 748 - 28.4 Grains.
Muzzle Velocity : 3350 FPS
Muzzle Energy: 1350 Ballistic Co-efficient: .229
Zero; 200 Yards
Trajectory: Muzzle: -1.5 / 100 Yards; 1.35 / 200 Yards: 0.0 / 300 Yards: -7.05 / 400 Yards: -22.1 /
/ 500 Yards: -48.6 / 600 Yards: -92.4
Works for me. Try it, you might like it. Sakojim.
Last edited:
To all Sako lovers and to new hand loaders. I feel that I should state that this is my opinion about hand loading because of the increasing requests. I have done so for many decades but will be the first to admit that it is a learning process no matter how long you may have done it. I would like to state the following which I have learned over the years. This may be helpful to newbies who have the patience to work for the best results. Remember the following comments.
No two identical rifles will hardly ever shoot the same with the same specific load. There is a difference in the weights of bullets in a box off the shelf. They should be separated by weights and loaded accordingly. There may be different results from separate cans of powder. Age and storage conditions effect quality. The same for primers. Powder should be thoroughly mixed before use and new cans should be treated as in a work-up loading process for best load. Never load a hot load with a new can of powder. The results may vary. There are also variations in primers. Match primers are held to a higher standard of quality control. Never use hand loaded cartridges that someone else has loaded.
Sako rifles are known for strong actions but some careless folks have suffered the consequence of pushing the envelope. Reference shooting conditions of work up loads. Temperature, altitude and density effect burn rate and pressure.
These are some of the reasons that I am reluctant to share loading information unless I am sure of the quality of the rifle to be used. If others disagree, please don't hesitate to throw in your comments. I hope that some of the hand loading experts will add to these suggestions to help those that are just getting started at hand loading. I always insist that all loads should be worked up slowly to the sweet load, but always look for signs of excessive pressure during the process.
The results are well worth the extra effort so you can put that pellet where you want it. Sakojim.
No two identical rifles will hardly ever shoot the same with the same specific load. There is a difference in the weights of bullets in a box off the shelf. They should be separated by weights and loaded accordingly. There may be different results from separate cans of powder. Age and storage conditions effect quality. The same for primers. Powder should be thoroughly mixed before use and new cans should be treated as in a work-up loading process for best load. Never load a hot load with a new can of powder. The results may vary. There are also variations in primers. Match primers are held to a higher standard of quality control. Never use hand loaded cartridges that someone else has loaded.
Sako rifles are known for strong actions but some careless folks have suffered the consequence of pushing the envelope. Reference shooting conditions of work up loads. Temperature, altitude and density effect burn rate and pressure.
These are some of the reasons that I am reluctant to share loading information unless I am sure of the quality of the rifle to be used. If others disagree, please don't hesitate to throw in your comments. I hope that some of the hand loading experts will add to these suggestions to help those that are just getting started at hand loading. I always insist that all loads should be worked up slowly to the sweet load, but always look for signs of excessive pressure during the process.
The results are well worth the extra effort so you can put that pellet where you want it. Sakojim.
