• Hey All! Lately there has been more and more scammers on the forum board. They register and replies to members requests for guns and/or parts or other things. The reply contains a gmail or hotmail address or similar ”anonymous” email addresses which they want you to reply to. DO NOT ANSWER ANY STRANGE MESSAGES! They often state something like this: ”Hello! Saw your post about purchasing a stock for a Safari. KnuckleheadBob has one. Email him at: [email protected]” If you receive any strange messages: Check the status of whoever message you. If they have no posts and signed up the same day or very recently, stay away. Same goes for other members they might refer to. Check them too and if they are long standing members, PM them and ask if the message is legit. Most likely it’s not. Then use the report function in each message or post so I can kick them out! Beware of anything that might seem fishy! And again, for all of you who registered your personal name as username, please contact me so I can change it to a more anonymous username. You’d be surprised of how much one can find out about a person from just a username on a forum such ad our! All the best! And be safe! Jim

Now for the barrel

Sako Collectors Club Discussion Forum

Chris Anderson

Well-Known Member
I'm in the process of building a custom rifle on an L461 action. I've got the action and the walnut blank but I could use some collective wisdom / opinions on what barrel to put on it.

This rifle is going to be a accurate, light weight, fun, walking around varminter. I searched the forum and compiled a list of the barrel manufactures discussed on SCC:

Bill Morrison
Pac-Nor
Greg Tannel
Shilen
Bartlein
Kreiger
Lilja
Hart
Gale McMillian​

Of those barrel manufactures it looks like Pac-Nor is talked about the most. How does Pac-Nor compare with the other barrel makers listed above. Could I get better accuracy/pricing from one of the other makers over Pac-Nor? Or will a Pac-Nor barrel shoot better than I can so further research is a waste of time?

If you were building a accurate, light weight, fun, walking around varminter what contour would you use? Is there somewhat of a contour standard or does everyone sort of do their own thing?

I want a specific distance from the bullet ogive to the lands. Can/will a barrel maker install my barrel to those specs or do I need to take it to a different gunsmith?

Your willingness to share your wisdom is appreciated.

Thanks
ChrisA
 
Hi Chris

Well for starters if Bill Morrison was still alive I would go for one of his barrels before any other. Bill made his own and as for quality they were head and shoulders above anything else on the market.

Now for realism. Pac Nor, Shilen, Hart or Greg Tannel all produce barrels of excellent quality and accuracy. The real question becomes, how long are you willing to wait for one?

Best of luck with your project.

rick
 
Now for realism. Pac Nor, Shilen, Hart or Greg Tannel all produce barrels of excellent quality and accuracy. The real question becomes, how long are you willing to wait for one?

I'm not in a big rush but it would be nice to have the barrel in a month or two. If you are wanting a standard barrel you can find some in stock barrels for some of the makers. But for some I see 4 - 6 month lead times.

I guess I'll have to contact these makers and see how far out they are.

Thanks Rick
 
Keep an eye out on this and other sites,\; I bought a new barrel for less than half price on 24HC.

Probably between any of those barrels, whatever you choose will be your favorite, there's probably not a difference any of us could tell.

Ask your builder's recommendation.
 
I had Dennis Olson build rifles for me and used Lilja barrels. They are both in Plains, Montana and do exceptional work. If you check one of the Nosler loading manuals, you will see just how many of the test barrels that were used in compiling that data, were Lilja barrels. If you want confirmation of this check out this independent source...http://riflebarrels.com/the-details-of-accuracy/
 
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One or two more questions ;-)

As I research barrel twist rates the posts are saying 1:12 and 1:14 are my best options. If I'm only shooting a Sierra 52 gr HPBT Match does it make any difference which of those twists I use? I'm sure I won't be using anything heaver than 55 gr but I've been thinking about something lighter, like maybe a 50 gr or 40 - 45 gr.

What kind of barrel profile do I want for a walking around varmint gun? I'm planning a 24" to help balance the 15" LOP I'll need but how thick/heavy do I want the barrel? How much taper do the ultra light sako barrels have?

Thanks
ChrisA
 
Caliber? Chambering?
I'm assuming 22 cal, You may want to step up (later) to a 60 gr partition or something a little heavier, thus I'd go with a slightly faster twist, maybe 8 to 10,
 
Caliber? Chambering?
I'm assuming 22 cal, You may want to step up (later) to a 60 gr partition or something a little heavier, thus I'd go with a slightly faster twist, maybe 8 to 10,

Oh, sorry. I guess that would be important information <sigh>.

I'm building a little 221 Fireball walking around varmint gun on an L461. I've decided to work up a load for the Sierra 52 gr HPBT and just use that one load.`

You probably know how it is ;). All of a sudden you want to go shooting with your buddy but when you go to grab your rifle you're not sure you remember which load it's sighted in for because you've been experimenting with different bullets/kinds of powder etc. So this will be a one load rifle that's always ready, because I've got 100 rounds of its favorite load on the shelf and it's for sure sighted in with that load.

I've always had real good luck with the Sierra 52 gr but if that doesn't work out I plan on sticking to the 45 gr to 55 gr bullets because of the small case size.

Thanks
Chris
 
All of a sudden you want to go shooting with your buddy but when you go to grab your rifle you're not sure you remember which load it's sighted in for because you've been experimenting with different bullets/kinds of powder etc.
I've long since sworn off having multiple loads for one rifle. Working up just one good load and sticking to it simplifies life. This is particularly true if you own a number of different rifles ample to cover all of your hunting/shooting needs and don't have to depend on a rifle to serve multiple purposes.

The Fireball is a real screamer with 40 grain bullets. In my two Fireballs I shoot exclusively a 40 grain polymer-tipped bullet (take your choice among brands as all are good). With either AA1680 or AA2200 you can push these between 3300 and 3400 fps, giving them a somewhat flatter trajectory than a heavier bullet. I can't think of anything I'd hunt with a Fireball which these bullets wouldn't be appropriate to (except for perhaps turkeys where you wouldn't want the explosive nature of the little pills.)
 
Working up just one good load and sticking to it simplifies life.

Simplified is what I'm shooting for. ;)


The Fireball is a real screamer with 40 grain bullets.... you can push these between 3300 and 3400 fps

That's real good for such a small case. I've never shot 40 gr in a .22 center fire but it sounds like I need to start.


except for perhaps turkeys where you wouldn't want the explosive nature of the little pills

Of course you could just shoot the turkey in the head.

Don't know if I'd be shooting coyotes with the .221 but I'd probably have to pick a less frangible bullet if I did.

If my go-to bullet is going to be a 40 gr I'd probably want a 1:14 twist barrel then, right? Or would there not be a noticeable difference between a 1:2 twist and a 1:14 twist with a 40 gr bullet?

Thanks stonecreek
 
No noticeable difference unless you are a REALLY good shot and practice A LOT!
If ordering new then get what you want (I'd go down to probably a 1:10 - just in case,) but it's your rifle, your project get what you want.
If you find a second hand barrel, then the twist will be what's available (basically - if I'm understanding you - any twist from say 8 or 9 to 14 will suit you fine)

Also, should you switch to a copper or "lead free" bullet - they are the same weight but longer, thus benefit from a slower twist (and more "jump" to the barrel).
A "less frangible" projectile will probably be longer too, thus liking a slower twist.
 
I know a lot of 22-250 guys go with fast twist like 1:8 so they can shoot longer bullets and reach way out there.

The really cool effect however is the bullets RPM’s are way higher which makes them explode a good deal more when they hit.
 
A 1-14" twist (long time the standard for .22 centerfires) will stabilize any conventional bullet up to 60 grains. You'll want much lighter bullets for your Fireball, so 1-14" is plenty of twist. By the way, early Sako .222 barrels were 1-16" (they just used the Hornet barrels at first) and the one I have shoots 55 grain Hornadys into dime-sized groups.

As to using 40 grain bullets, just ask Kirkbridger, who probably shoots five times the number of prairie dogs each year than I do. He swears by them even in larger cases like the .222 Magnum.
 
Dime size groups just means getting a good gunsmith, good barrel... maybe a custom reamer...

More important make sure you tell the guy the bullets and brass you use so he can chamber it for what you want.
 
Dime size groups just means getting a good gunsmith, good barrel...

I've got a good gunsmith and I'm planning on a Lilja barrel but I've never considered a custom reamer. So I'd have a reamer made specifically for the brand of brass, bullet ogive and loaded length? I am going to send him a bullet so he can measure for himself. How expensive are custom reamers?

Dime sized groups are my goal so what ever it takes.

Thanks
ChrisA
 
The only time I ever had a reamer made it cost somewhere above 100 bucks, but that was 20 years ago.

And if anybody needs a finish reamer in 8x57R/360 (not 8x57 Mauser), only used once, send me a PM.
 
Lilja Barrels
I have had several rimfire and center fire rifles built using Lilja barrels
Greg Tannel built two .17 Remington -one was on a Sako 75 action; Butch Weyand at Cascade Arms two Cascade Extreme rifles (.17 Ackley & .22 Mink) and two Alpine rifles in .17 Squirrel; Gordy Gritters re-barreled a Model 70 and two Winchester model 52s.
Excellent workman ship and excellent barrels.
Any of the barrels you listed will work.
Have fun!
Jim
 
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I was lucky enough to learn the “Gritters method” of chambering a barrel from Gordy himself - but custom reamers today are not 100 bucks anymore.
 

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